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The Sector Skills Council for the places where we live and work 

EIF Round 2 Bid Employer endorsements

Below is a list of all contributors, please either click on the name to view their comments, or scroll down the page to view all comments.

Kim Newman
PML Group

Margaret Mason
West Lothian Council
Ann Belton
G4S
Simon Lymn
Royal Grammar School
Sue Laycock
InCommunities
Paul Thrupp
OCS
Angie Blaylock
Stockton On Tees
Borough Council 
Geraldine McGuigan
Northern Ireland
Housing Executive
Ian Roughhead
Hounslow Homes
Steve Davies
Compass Group UK
& Ireland
Katharyn Jellings
Cymorth Cymru
Tony Kilpatrick
Glasgow Caledonian
University
Michael Williams 
Alliance Homes
(NSHousing)

Darren Yates
In-Depth Cleaning
Services

Iain A. Murray
Europa
Dawn Powell
Southern Housing
Group
Richard Burnett 
The Property Company
Geraldine Shortall
ARMA
Michael Sands
Department for Social
Development
(Northern Ireland)
Lorraine Macdonald
Speirs Gumley
Jasmine Wilson
Ceredigion County
Council
Judith Layzell
Peter Alan Ltd
Peter Carroll
British Cleaning Council
Linda Gittings
Festival Housing
Group
June Lancaster 
NHS
May Stark
Transparency FM
Solutions Limited
Jacqueline Furness
Places for People
(Homes)
Simon Forrester
BPCA
Barry Norris
MITIE
Robert Tamburrini
North Glasgow
Housing Association
Malcolm Cannon
ESPC (UK) Ltd
Louise Terry
The Royal Mint
Brian Cummins
OCS
Keith Hamer
Carillion
Chris Hoar 
Facilities Management
Association
Judith Chapman
Serco
Christine Amyes
New Charter
Housing Trust Group
Clare Mawdsley-
Geoghegan

Plus Dane Group
Ian Bostock
Sanctuary Group
Chris Cracknell
OCS
Julie Potter
UPL Ltd
Bob Waddell
The City of Edinburgh
Council
Lucinda McMurran
NIFHA
Donna Rodgers
Vela Group

 

Kim Newman, PML Group, 10/08 (FM Technical Advisory Group)

I have scanned the documents provided and have no significant comment to make other than to confirm my agreement and positive support for the bid.


Sue Laycock, InCommunities, 10/08 (Housing Board)

Do you agree with the aim of each strand?

I have read through each of the strands and consider that the aims of each strand are well articulated and well grounded in reality - many of the aims overlap with objectives that appear either in the strategic plan of my organisation or in my job related objectives, so I anticipate that if these proposals are accepted, the work of asset skills would add value to and inform what we, and other organisations like mine, are trying to achieve.

Does the summary clearly articulate the issues?

I think that the summaries present a good overview of the issues.

Are the proposed actions achievable?

Some of the actions are more ambitious than others and thus I think some are potentially easier to achieve. However, I believe that it would be unfortunate if Asset Skills were to identify only actions which were seen to be "safe" as opposed to presenting a challenge. That said, I consider that Asset Skills has a strong track record of delivery and must continue to be ambitious in the goals it sets. Accordingly, I am confident that the actions identified are appropriate and are achievable.

Will the actions lead to the desired measurable impact?

I think it is difficult to say with complete certainty that actions will always result in the desired measurable impact, but again, if you were to ask me if I had confidence in this being more likely than not, my answer would be yes.

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Ian Roughead, Hounslow Homes, 11/08 (on behalf of Graham Spiller, Housing Board)

…….. we have just recently finalised an intake of employees to undertake QCF and CIH certificate in Housing and would want to support your bid for continued funding.

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Michael Williams, Alliance Homes (NSHousing), 11/08 (on behalf of Helen Gwynne, Alliance Homes: Housing Board)

At a general level Alliance Homes is very supportive of your bid and the aims of each strand because they address real issues that we are tackling at an organisational level and it is very encouraging to see that these are the areas of focus for your bid. We would welcome the opportunity to be involved in leading the development of many of your proposed activities should you be successful with the bid. In particular we are looking to:

  • Create an accredited development programme for people harder to reach - we would like to make this available across the sector
  • provide Housing qualifications that are more focused on employer needs- we would like to make this available across the sector
  • Look at the feasibility of creating a social enterprise to create training and employment opportunities for young people.

We would also welcome the opportunity to meet with Assets Skills to discuss how we could take a lead in the housing sector on initiatives that increase skills and employment.

(see also comments within draft Executive Summaries, provided separately)

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Richard Burnett, The Property Company, 11/08

While I have to say that the particular topics covered in your attachments are not exactly within my expertise, I am happy to go on record as a supporter of your organisation and in favour of what you are aiming to achieve. I find your organisation beneficial to the employer and to the workforce and would encourage it to continue with its good works.

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Jasmine Wilson, Ceredigion County Council, 11/08

I agree that the issues you set out to achieve should be successful in what you hope to achieve.

I have some concerns as to the value of NVQ as a qualification as I personally do not believe it is a useful tool for any employee/employer. It is my opinion that it is a tick box exercise & does not prepare the employee/trainee for the real world.

I have received an e mail from Jan re the Women in Work & BICSc COPC scheme. Now I really do believe that this is a worthwhile scheme. Indeed whilst it will be valuable to women it will be equally valuable to the male workforce & especially valuable to the long term unemployed or to the potential employee who has no qualification/learning issues. This is the qualification that all cleaners need & it does make them instantly more employable & a more attractive prospect to companies who wish to recruit. Indeed if I was presented with two employees & all being equal & one had BICSc COPC & the other the NVQ then I would be more likely to employee the BICSc qualified one. I know that BICSc has tightened up on the companies who were passing people as BICSc qualified just for attending a course/training session. We currently access the BICSc training via our supplier namely Premiere Products of Cheltenham who have a brilliant set up for training & are accredited by BICSc. Indeed their previous training manager Colin Hanks has become the Training & Education Manager for BICSc in Northampton & he is trying to drive up the standards in the cleaning industry nationally.

For some time I have suggested to anyone I can that if they want to improve some ones job prospects especially the less motivated, the long term unemployed, or those that require extra support to learn good then this course is an exceptionally good one to start with. Indeed all my staff who have been on it come back remotivated, have been very glad of the opportunity e.g. one said "I didn't think there was much point on going on a course as I had been cleaning all my life but what an eye opener now I'm proud to say I am a cleaner, that I'm qualified, I'm now a cleaning supervisor, I'm doing my NVQ & looking forward to doing my Part 2 BISCs COPC later in the year. I never had any qualifications before" Our NVQ assessor Lee from Network training went on the course after I suggested he needed too, so that he would have a better understanding of the cleaning processes. I understand that many other assessors from Network training are now also BICSc trained as well.

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June Lancaster, NHS, 11/08 (Business Services Board)

I have carefully read all of the documents, fully support the bids as they stand. Their seems a great deal of work but the outcome if successful should add significant value to the sector, especially the SME, who do not have the infrastructure to provide the right level of opportunities for learning and development as the larger companies.

I was impressed with the approach taken with the careers stream, in the light of anticipated changes to current provision this work stream would add great value.

I was also very interested in the stream relating to the development of managers as supporters of the learners, essential, often not seen as a key role of managers.

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Barry Norris, MITIE, 11/08 (Academy Employer Group)

I think I can say that most of the attached would have our support with a couple of exceptions or provisos:

  1. I am not convinced that Talent Management should be something on which Asset Skills focuses its attention or resources. This a matter which is more appropriately left to individual businesses to embrace if they so wish. If such an approach does emerge, however, our ability to involve ourselves is small. We are engaged across just about every sector in which Asset Skills operates and so at some level almost every company with which we might share information would be a competitor
  2. In respect of the EIF Routeways, it is somewhat difficult for me to make a central commitment on behalf of our businesses, as recruitment is an activity which is driven locally. In essence we dictate as little process centrally as we have to, leaving it to the people on the ground to act in a manner which best serves customer needs. The size of our business also mitigates against too much dictat from the centre because of the number of relevant managers who need to be identified and briefed. Practically, however, I am sure our local businesses would be only too pleased to pick up potential candidates who have been prepared for their part of the sector in some way; I am merely hesitant to make a formal commitment to such, on behalf of the wider MITIE.

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Brian Cummins, OCS, 12/08 (Academy Employer Group)

Having read all of the attachments, I can confirm that within my remit of L&D I am in support of all proposed actions. They meet the needs of the direction that we want to take going forward.

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Christine Amyes, New Charter Housing Trust Group, 12/08 (Housing Board)

I support the bids made and think the executive summaries set out very clearly the aims and desired outcomes of each strand. I think they are ambitious and stretching but achievable.

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Julie Potter, UPL Ltd, 12/08 (Wales Board)

Do you agree with the aim of each strand?

Yes, the aims are clear and highlight issues

which are important to me as an employer.

Does the summary clearly articulate the issues?

Yes

Are the proposed actions achievable?

Ambitious, but I think achievable with the required buy in from employers.

Will the actions lead to the desired measurable impact?

I believe they will.

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Margaret Mason, West Lothian Council, 12/08

I have read over your document and please find detailed below my response to your questions:

Do you agree with the aim of each strand?

I do agree with the aims - I feel there are many good practices currently being deployed by employers but tend to work in silos - having Asset Skills introduce strategies which would

co-ordinate the needs of the employer and the workforce and allow clearer streams to share best practice and maximise potential is a positive way forward.

I was interested in your ideas regarding working closer with Schools - stronger links with the Career Advisors within schools and employers is to be encouraged and establishing a service that also links Career contacts in Schools with Employers would be beneficial in raising awareness of the requirements of employers to heighten their understanding too.

Does the summary clearly articulate the issues?

The summary does articulate the issues well

Are the proposed actions achievable?

The proposed actions would be achievable if partnership working is maximised and clear goals and vision shared by all participants

Will the actions lead to the desired measurable impact?

Properly coordinated and continual review and evaluation of the Activities should achieve the desired outcomes and impact.

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Paul Thrupp, OCS, 12/08 (Business Services Board)

Do you agree with the aim of each strand?

I can confirm on behalf of OCS that I fully endorse and support the aim of each strand;

Does the summary clearly articulate the issues?

I believe that the summaries are concise and do articulate the issues

Are the proposed actions achievable?

The proposed actions are quite rightly challenging but certainly achievable;

Will the actions lead to the desired measurable impact?

I believe they will.

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Steve Davies, Compass Group UK & Ireland, 12/08 (Business Services Board)

  1. Barriers to Engagement in Skills Development - I agree with the aim and I think the activities and outcomes are aligned. My only comment would be if time is the critical barrier, how in this modern world of technology we could include the use of e-learning perhaps using blackberry's or smart phones?
  2. Careers - Well presented, articulate and concise
  3. Increasing Investment in Higher Level Skills - I would put more emphasis on the outcome (g). If we failed our last submissions by not putting a greater level of support from employers, then should the number 1 outcome be a greater up take.
  4. Talent Management - I agree with the aim but it would be so much more powerful if the trial was with employers in the FM space?
  5. Routes to employment within the Asset Skills Sector - I am always nervous about proposals that create a database. There will be many databases of job opportunities in the FM world why is ours different? Outcome (b) is very positive and if there was a database of these people managed and updated regularly this would be helpful.
  6. Monitoring and maintaining the strategic business plan -This is the weakest submission and whilst I am sure the programme is very important the submission does not stand out. I think the aim works but need more substance for the activities and outcomes.

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Darran Yates, In-Depth Cleaning Services, 12/08 (Cleaning Technical Advisory Group)

Happy to support them.

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Geraldine Shortall, ARMA, 12/08 (Property Services Board)

I can confirm that I have read through the strands and wholeheartedly :

  1. agree with the aims
  2. found the summary quite clear
  3. the proposed actions should be achievable I believe given my experience of Asset Skills abilities
  4. again, I believe Asset Skills is perfectly capable of achieving the desired outcomes

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Judith Layzell, Peter Alan Ltd, 12/08 (Wales Board)

This is to confirm that I have gone through the submission papers and agree with the aims of the papers.

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May Stark, Transparency FM Solutions Limited, 14/08 (Scotland Board)

Reading the documents has highlighted something which is always at the back of mind and something which may or may not be of any interest - I taught the HNC Accommodation Servicing and HND in Accommodation Management both qualifications sit firmly in what is known as the Hospitality Industry but in reality both cover many aspects of Facilities Management. It is something which should be considered when entering into dialogue with schools - a career in hospitality is often seen as catering but more emphasis needs to put on the other services and the link to FM.

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Robert Tamburrini, North Glasgow Housing Association, 15/08 (Scotland Board)

This response is not on behalf of the Scottish Board. Given the EIF deadlines and due to the holiday period, opportunities to consult have been problematic.

While pressures on ASC, due to the new strategy adopted by UKCES and EIF, are understood and appreciated, you will also appreciate that our comments on the executive summaries and the likely scope and content of a bid(s) are given (a) from a Scottish context and perspective in general and (b) from a social housing context and perspective in particular.

The purpose of the comments is to give you an idea of our interest in the UKCES Prospectus and EIF Phase 2 Submission and leave it to the experience and expertise of your bid team to note or accommodate our particular preferences/wishes if this is at all practicable.

The Scottish Government (SG) is in the process of simplifying its skills policy and strategy and, in that regard, while it wishes to retain links with UK-wide skills bodies to ensure a UK perspective where such a perspective is useful, it also wants a system of SSCs that 'works for Scotland'.

Among other things, it wants the SSCs to be more effectively aligned in Scotland with Industry Advisory Groups and Third Sector Skills Partnerships in the development of strategic skills. It wants a more effective clustering around Scotland's key economic sectors and high participation sectors. The housing sector, in spite of current difficulties and contractions, is a high participation sector, as is the social housing sector in Scotland.

The Scottish Skills Strategy is affected by the strategic economic areas that the Government would wish to support in terms of policy imperatives. The strategic economic priorities are -

  • Learning, Skills and Well-being (but particularly the research base)
  • Supporting the Business Environment (particularly high value and added value businesses … energy, tourism, financial and business services, food and drink, creative industries, life-sciences and university-business initiatives)
  • Infrastructure (primarily transport)
  • The Green Agenda
  • Effective Government

In all respects, SG also stresses the importance of enterprise and enterprise skills in all sectors, including the public sector.

With regard to the housing sector and, in our case, to the social housing sector, all of these strategic areas, given their wider impact, are of interest and concern to us but some more so than others it has to be said. We are particularly affected by and interested in:

  1. Learning, Skills and Well-Being
  2. Social Enterprise
  3. Low Carbon Transition, Renewable Energies and Environmental Management In these regards

We would emphasise that low carbon transition, renewable energies and environmental management should not simply be regarded as discrete to the Energy Sector or to the Construction sector or, as SG frequently says, as 'having export development potential', all of which are valid to some extent, but are also of critical importance to the housing sector.

Low carbon transition, low carbon technologies, energy efficient action plans intimately concern and are beginning to have a major impact on the housing sector. Similarly with environmental services and the social enterprise opportunities these may afford.

Accordingly there is little doubt that we need a revised skills framework that takes adequately into consideration the obligations of Registered Social Landlords regarding economic and social regeneration, social enterprise, energy consumption and efficiency, fuel poverty and environmental services in respect of its housing stock, and what low carbon initiatives, for example, imply with regard to purchasing, installing, servicing and maintaining appliances, changing consumer behaviour and adapting skills to suit new demands. Additionally, regarding the regeneration and development of the built environment, new environmental management and environmental services are of huge importance. To support these obligations and developments, we need to:

  • Make better use of the existing skills of staff, making them more reflexive and pro-active
  • Adapt existing skills to new challenges (e.g. renewable energies)
  • Ensure that qualifications and certification are appropriate to new tasks and demands such as renewable energy strategies and plans, energy consumption and consumer behaviour
  • Develop our workforce, particularly housing officers, maintenance staff, technicians in order to improve capacity
  • Re-skill our workforce where necessary (e.g. new environmental services)
  • Introduce new skills (social enterprise)

To achieve these objectives, we need an up-to-date 'skills framework' that reflects the new and wider roles involved in housing provision, management and servicing. We need an apprenticeship framework that reflects the multiple and changing tasks involved in facilities provision and management.

While we appreciate the rationale, content and scope of the 5 'executive' summaries, we are not clear about their relevance to Scotland. You will be aware that the emphasis in Scotland is on modern apprenticeships (e.g. in facilities management). And while we appreciate the desire to develop an MA in Facilities Management, we understand that such a development can only be done with one University at a time (unless by VLE). This may reduce the potential currency and practicality of such an MA. It might be more realistic in the medium term, in spite of the criticisms you say that employers mention, to go for improvements in HNC/D provision. Or you could explore, if you have not done so already, other options like part-time post-graduate certificates and diplomas for graduates with 'general' subject expertise and transferable skills and explore such possibilities with organisations like the Institute of Work-Based Learning at Middlesex University. But these are just suggestions.

Otherwise, I have some minor comments:

(a) The bid team referred to the concept of 'toolkit'. This is possibly an ambiguous term. The 'toolkit' approach was first developed by international charities as a way of making their activities in under-developed countries more practical and effective (cf. Tear Fund Toolkit, first developed in the 1990s). Then the bureaucrats got hold of it and abused it, using it willy-nilly to mean 'template', 'guide' and even 'monitoring tool'. The original toolkit was developed as a means of implementing a practical programme of actions that was inclusive of the ultimate beneficiaries in its conception, implementation and evaluation. In that regard, it fostered direct engagement and a sharing of ownership in the programme of works. So, what you may mean by 'toolkit' needs to made clearer.

(b) With regard to Scotland, please note that our national qualifications framework is SCQF (Scottish Credit and Qualifications Framework Partnership). It is not quite the same as England's. We have 12 levels, not 11.

(c) We would like to see 'social enterprise' mentioned - while many are nascent and exploratory, they are innovative and promising and very relevant to housing and regeneration. They require an appropriate skills set. And while they may be perceived as the kind of initiative that would be promoted primarily by the voluntary sector, they are not sector-specific. They are, however, of keen interest to RSLs and when linked to the transition to low carbon energy solutions and to environmental service improvements, they have a lot of potential and significant implications for skills development.

I trust these comments are helpful and I wish you and your writing team every success in their endeavours to secure project funding.

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Keith Hamer, Carillion, 15/08 (FM Technical Advisory Group)

1. I understand and can agree with the aim of each strand.

2. Whilst in some cases a little more detailed than others, the purpose and objectives seem clear;

3. Three specific comments:

a. Monitoring and maintaining the strategic business plan - it needs to refer to a steering group to define ownership to oversee and act on LMI;

b. Talent Management - Each participating company considers Talent management a key business function and have already well developed programmes. The uniqueness of a company is defined by its talent, the idea of collaboration across the sector with large employers may not be well received in this regard. I think the focus here has to be on retention of the available talent within the sector.

c. Routeways - local employment focus must be the aim of this programme. Some employers may not consider that 2 weeks training will improve employability - a big emphasis here must be toward attitude / behaviour for potential employees and what employers expect.

4. I think more work needs to be done to create measures which will define the success of each strand - doing so will further define the outputs which in turn will shape the actions and objectives.

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Clare Mawdsley-Geoghegan, Plus Dane Group, 15/08 (Housing Board)

Basically I am supportive of the initiatives but I do have some small comments and questions for some of the summaries.

Talent Management - Good idea, timely project as many people in the sector are talking about talent management and ways to make it work. The business to business mentoring would be particularly useful, as would the recognised redundancy support service. A resource between organisations would prevent peer mentoring and coaching in businesses that just end up sharing poor practice as well as good.

Careers - Again I am supportive. This would particularly help us to target apprenticeships to school leavers and focus the work we already do with Education Business partnerships and direct with schools when we arrange work experience to get school leavers to think of our sector for careers

Routes to employment - not relevant to Liverpool or Cheshire so I didn't read further

Investment in Higher Level Skills - Supportive of the project. I'm not clear on the links you'd make with University. For example, we already work with one local uni on a world of work programme. The chance to share info with the database of employers and HEIS would be useful so that we know what projects are possible in the areas we work in.

Barriers to engagement in skills development - I can't see the need for this so much. It might be more useful for smaller organisations but we are already operating at a size where we have economies of scale already.

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Bob Waddell, The City of Edinburgh Council, 15/08 (Scotland Board)

Having now had some time to digest the documentation you sent, I can confirm that I wholeheartedly support all the proposals tabled.

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Ann Belton,G4S, 15/08 (Academy Employer Group)

I have been through the documents attached and would just offer the following comments:

Careers - this has the potential to raise the profile of FM and related careers and increase awareness and understanding amongst schools and their pupils with potential to develop shadowing/placements etc.

Routes to Employment - potentially very interesting and something that I think a number of our contracts may have an interest in.

Barriers to Skills Development - I can see no mention of basic skills - e.g. basic literacy and those for whom English is a 2nd language - these do present barriers to skills development. Similarly, will there be any further work in overcoming gender imbalance in areas of FM?

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Angie Blaylock, Stockton On Tees Borough Council, 15/08

it does what it says on the tin. Just some comments

  1. 'is two weeks long enough to get someone work ready'? My experience is it needs to be longer .
  2. Mapping opportunities and vacancies is crucial particularly to encourage school age/ apprentices into the sector , they need to know there is a clear route to employment and a career , far too many training schemes don't link to local employment market . Unfortunately there have been providers of awards who have been running apprenticeships/ awards and taking no account of the market need just churning out awards and drawing down funding . I presume you would be linking in with the national apprenticeship service somewhere along the line too.

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Kathryn Jellings, Cymorth Cymru, 15/08 (Housing Board)

We are very supportive of all three strands and as a representative organisation would be keen to gain the involvement of our members also.

My only comment would be that I'd like to see greater emphasis on mentoring, job shadowing and peer support in some of the areas mentioned.


Iain A. Murray, Europa, 15/08 (Scotland Board)

I have read and I am very pleased to concur with the documents as provided, please enjoy our complete support.

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Michael Sands, Department for Social Development (Northern Ireland), 15/08 (Northern Ireland Board)

I am content with your bid.

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Peter Carroll, British Cleaning Council, 15/08 (Cleaning Technical Advisory Group)

I have spoken with our Gen Secretary and the BCC offers total support for the project and the aim of each strand. I have sent this to some of our partners and they will offer feedback on whether each aim is practical in the business context.

With regards to the executive summaries, I would guess that they could be summarised further (a summary of a summary perhaps), which you could use on marketing material. I think that this would be useful in attracting partners/businesses etc to the project at the early stage.

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Jacqueline Furness, Places for People (Homes), 16/08 (Housing Board)

In principle all look like they would be valuable pieces of work in particular the careers piece of work - it is a real issue getting people to select housing as a choice of a career - often something people fall into.

As a large housing org we are in the lucky position to already be doing a talent mgt piece of work - not withstanding that - it is a critical piece of work which I suspect smaller orgs do not have the time to do and thus I think it would be incredibly valuable for that reason. And of course - I am always interested to see what ideas other people come up with.

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Malcolm Cannon, ESPC (UK) Ltd, 16/08 (Scotland Board)

They seem short, easy to read and reasonably clear but the prospectus is way too long, cumbersome and not quantitative. It also focuses on the wrong sectors and this MUST be challenged. The sectors are supposed to be 'high growth'….energy (and in particular, renewables) being a given but how can food and drink (while very important to Scotland, certainly NOT a high growth sector) be higher priority than property (currently on its knees and hence looking to grow massively over the coming years - perhaps not to where it once was but way larger than now).

I am not sure whether the actions are achievable as they have not yet been tested in the real practical world - merely a theory.

Likewise, I am not sure how measurable the impact is.

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Chris Hoar, Facilities Management Association, 16/08 (Business Services Board)

I agree with the four summary points and the answer to them all is yes. Have you considered the programmes that some of the large FM providers have in place already and how this would integrate?

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Ian Bostock, Sanctuary Group, 16/08 (Academy Employer Group)

My initial view is that they do summarise very well our current challenges. I have briefly discussed the documents with Amanda Gonsalves (our Group Head of HR) and we hope to take the opportunity to talk through some of those challenges in more detail when we meet with Steven Proudfoot and Catherine Hinton next week.

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Lucinda McMurran, NIFHA, 16/08 (Northern Ireland Board)

I confirm my support for the actions described in the various attachments to your email.

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Simon Lymn, Royal Grammar School, 16/08 (Business Services Board)

I've now had a chance to look at all the proposals and feel that they are all valid & very much needed.

Do you seek to do all or select & prioritise projects against some yet to be agreed criteria?

I feel the DWP project will be difficult to deliver given:

  • My knowledge of working with organisations in the voluntary, private & college training sectors
  • My understanding of the FM sector and its complexity
  • My experience of the target groups involved would lead me to suggest delivering sustainable outcomes would be difficult

I understand this is just a very short response but would be willing to discuss my thoughts at length if you thought it appropriate.

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Geraldine McGuigan, Northern Ireland Housing Executive, 16/08 (Housing Board)

I've had a brief look at these. The presentation is clear and succinct and there is a practical approach to each strand. I have one small question in relation to the 3 key activities in the talent management strand. Activities 1& 2 relate to leaders in organisation - is the third activity aimed at HR professionals or both HR and leaders?

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Tony Kilpatrick, Glasgow Caledonian University, 16/08 (on behalf of James Sommerville: Scotland Board)

From the perspective of a Construction and Surveying Department I would respond positively to the questions set out in the email from Steven Proudfoot.

There are some questions I would have on points in the EIF Round 2 - HE Executive Summary. Specifically, if I understand correctly, the formation of the UK academy.

How will this interact with/avoid duplication of the work of HEIs?

Will it be the main focus of the 'cohesive HE offer'?

There are initiatives in the HE sector that bring together research, knowledge transfer and innovation such as CIC Start online, LCBE and LCBE Gateway.

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Dawn Powell, Southern Housing Group, 17/08 (Housing Board)

I agree with all the strands and I am particularly interested in the talent management project.

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Lorraine MacDonald, Speirs Gumley, 17/08

I do absolutely support your bid and the work of Assets Skills in fact tomorrow will be meeting with PMAS council to discuss support for the proposed apprentice scheme ibeing considered n Property Management


Linda Gittings, Festival Housing Group, 17/08 (Housing Board)

I have read the three papers and I support these documents.


Simon Forrester, BPCA, 19/08 (Business Services Board)

No significant comments from BPCA at this time.

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Louise Terry, The Royal Mint, 19/08

I have read your documents and would to express my support with regards to your proposals. The Barriers to Engagement sums up exactly the problems we face with training existing employees. These are lost time in production, training around existing working practices, and provision. We also experience difficulty with the transferring of new skills from the workshop to the workplace and are trying to address this with on the job coaching. It is great to see a sector skills council recognising these "real life" issues.

Another barrier we have is that one training course does not suit all and to have an ability to assess skills and match this to learning would be a great asset to the benefits of training.

Also ideally it would be great to have the ability for training to be always assessable. It is not always about training in the classroom but having an organisation that is immersed in training, every day.

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Judith Chapman, Serco, 19/08 (Academy Employer Group)

Having reviewed all the executive summaries for each strand of the proposal, I believe that the aims of each strand are clear and that you have also highlighted what the issues are that we are currently facing.

The actions identified are achievable, but I wasn't clear on the timescale as this could be a barrier. However, I think the outcomes identified will enable you to measure the impact.

From our point of view, we are only involved on the cleaning side, so as such, we would only be included in a smaller part of your programme.

We also have to take into account that whilst the concept of providing mentoring and support networks is very sound, we operate in a very competitive marketplace and have to be mindful of this when getting involved with programmes of this kind given that we would want to keep details of how/what/where/why/when we operate confidential. Please do not see this as a negative comment, more a realistic one in our marketplace! We do however, already have some great succession planning tools in place and this is extremely well supported within our business.

I think that the executive summary for careers is particularly exciting and one in which all employers should be able to engage, including ourselves, particularly as our Chief Executive has this year committed to proving 500 apprenticeships and 1000 work experience placements (of 8 weeks duration).

In addition, the monitoring and maintaining the strategic business plan executive summary would be extremely helpful to us, given that this would look at analysis of skills challenges, priorities and preferred solutions and provide regular labour market information-this would be of benefit to us.

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Julie Morosco for Chris Cracknell, OCS, 22/08 (Board Chair)

I took the opportunity to discuss this with three members of my senior team when we were together last week, and the comments below reflect the views, therefore, of the Head of Organisation Development, the Head of Employment Services and the Human Resources Director for the Facilities Services division of OCS in the UK.

Please do not hesitate to ask if you need clarification or further detail on anything below:

As a member of Asset Skills OCS actively supports their approach to bids to the Employer Investment Fund (EIF).

In general, we believe that the individual strands' aims are relevant to the development of the sector. Individual statements and comments on specific strands are made below.

The summaries are, on the whole succinct although some comments below may be useful in focussing them further.

It is difficult to assess whether actions are achievable. This would require a more detailed review of resources available and timelines, as is the case with most projects. This said, should the actions be achieved we are confident that desired impacts will also be achieved.

Barriers to Engagement in Skills development

We support this fully. It makes perfect sense and attacks one of the key hurdles to embedding the concept of the Learning Organisation in businesses.

Comment:
One element that may have been missed is the value of engaging on the basis of 'relevance'. People like learning from their actual work experience. So an action to examine methods of recognising and accrediting day to day experiences at the workplace through recording learning from incident de-briefs, peer assessment, manager coaching and action learning projects etc. In this sense we can promote the belief that every day at work is a learning opportunity.

Talent management

We are supportive of the main principle here with regards to building a talent management capability.

Comment:
The project needs to ensure that we gain a wider definition of talent management than that simply offered by the CIPD. For example, talent management can be defined as ensuring that the competency needs of the business and the competencies of individuals are aligned. This drives better performance and ensures that the organisation and its people all travel in the same mutually beneficial direction.

Also, there is a real danger here of identifying Talent as something exclusive. Some Leadership development programmes are defined by their exclusivity and lack of diversity. We must discourage employers from developing these monolithic approaches to leadership and succession planning in their businesses. Talent can come from anywhere in our businesses and we should be developing the ability to spot it across diverse groups of employees.

With this in mind, it is important that Talent and Leadership Development Programmes takes account of this diversity. Great businesses make the most of all their talent and don't just develop a few brains in order to pull the rest along. The best leaders of the future may be well hidden in our organisations and the wrong approach to this subject will disengage them.

Careers

Once again we are total agreement with this aspect of the submission.

Comment:

The International Facilities Management Association identified this issue as one of their top ten trends in the future of facilities management. We at OCS are beginning this journey through the establishment of our Integrated Outreach Group which Asset Skill will be represented on. One of the aspects of the group's work will be to build a greater level of cooperative penetration into the schools so we can play our part in building new positive perceptions of careers in FM and support services and encourage young people to take up apprenticeships in the industry.

This is as much a challenge of changing the perceptions of key teaching professionals in the school system. Some teaching professional themselves have difficulty with the whole language of business and industry. Maybe some kind of awareness programme for teaching staff could be developed?

Finally, it's not young people that get stressed out about their futures it's is usually their parents or guardians. Once again, a programme of engagement for this group may also help.

Increasing investment in Higher Education

This is one area that the industry and business in general appears not to engage enough and we support Asset Skills in their work to forge a closer relationship between Academia and the world of business.

Comment:

We believe that a better structured approach to building the work experience of Undergraduates and Graduates can only serve the sector positively.

We would make the following suggestions to encourage further collaboration and exploit the benefits of both sectors working together:

  • Alongside Taught Masters Programmes, HE to develop a business focussed and candidate friendly MPhil/PHD Programme which will allow for senior managers to pursue business relevant projects with academic rigour over a longer space of time. This would encourage more medium to long term thinking in businesses and contribute to the development of the sector. It would also allow for flexibility so that candidates can take longer and not be constricted by the requirements of a taught programme.
  • Introducing appropriately trained Business Supervisors for Undergraduate and Post Graduate research programmes who work in cooperation with a relevant Academic Supervisor.
  • Build a relevant list of possible programmes of research either business or sector focussed for Undergraduates and Post Graduates to reference. These may come with appropriately funded placements.
  • More use of Academic input to business conferences / workshops at Undergraduate and Post Graduate level.

Monitoring and maintaining the strategic business plan.

We are in total agreement with this approach to developing the strategic business plan and would be happy to be actively involved in this project going forward.

Routes to employment in the Asset Skills Sector.

Whilst we are broadly in support of the need for Asset Skills to increase its involvement in the development of routes to the sector, we would advise caution.

Comment:

It is employers who are in the business of employing people and not Asset Skills. By being involved too much in this area of recruitment Asset Skills may find themselves dogged down too much in the work that, quite frankly, employers in the sector should be doing as part of their 'business as usual'. How an employer attracts and recruits to their business can be a powerful differentiator. This could, therefore, cross the boundary between healthy cooperation and competitive advantage. We would suggest, therefore, that Asset Skills focuses its work in this area more on building mechanisms to share Best Practice across the sector.

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Donna Rodgers, Vela Group, 06/09

We fully understand that our company has missed the opportunity for consultation, however we feel this project aligns with our future vision and plan, therefore we would like to work with yourselves moving forward and be involved in future work as the Vela Group.

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